Karaoke Forums

Howdy yall from Alabama. I've been reading here for a couple of weeks and thought I would finally get some advice from some of you. I'm about to start a contest at the club I'm at. I'm looking for any suggestions or tips that any of you would be willing to give. It's gonna be a mid week contest, trying to add a third night to my Fri. and Sat. night gig. Probably gonna be 6 or 8 weeks, with cash and prizes to be given away. I guess I'm just looking for that special "hook"? Thanks in advance for any advice you're willing to give.

Sorry to sound like a downer, but my best advice:
Don't do it.
Contests tend to turn of your regulars and there's ALWAYS some who come away with a sour taste in their mouth.
If you DO choose to do it anyway, DON'T judge. Have someone else do it or you will be thought of as choosing favorites and will lose all credibility as a host.

Thanks diafel. Didn't come across as a downer at all. I've actually had pretty successful contests in the past. I won the very first contest this club had 3 years ago, which led me to eventually getting this gig. I never judge, and I always have someone else tally the votes. I have a good core group of regulars, and my rotation averages 15-25 singers. We're just trying to get another night going and thought I would ask around on here how contests are run in other parts of the country.

Contests can be fine if run properly. If it's a major prize - like $500 or more, i'd run a minimum 5 weeks, with a semifianls dropping down to maybe 15-20 contestants, then the finals. 5-6 judges all with some kind of musical experience - ie local band members that are karaoke friendly, radio personalities, vocal instructors, etc..Sometimes you can get free radio advertising with the local dj.
Contests in general can be good or bad depending on how they are run, i've run several in the 17 years i've been running shows with little to no demise on my personal show. Yes you will end up with outsiders - who doesn't want to win big money, sometimes they will become regulars, more often they wont. COULD piss off your regulars - this is a chance you will take.

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Here is what I have found time and time again with contests:

1: You get a bunch more "diva attitude" customers.

2: You get more "diva attitude" customers.

3: You level out, but your regulars get a little put-out.

4: A few regulars will leave. A few diva's will leave.

5: More regulars leave. Bar manager notices takings are down.

...

At the end of the contest you will not keep the diva's, and you will have alienated a few regulars.

Contests CAN be done well, but I personally am not a fan. Again this may be because I don't see karaoke as competitive - and don't like those who competitive singing attracts (Mariah Carey wannabe's)

NLouch, You seem to be just as fixated on some non existent Diva problem as Eric is fixated with his non existent freeloader problem. For it to be a REAL problem, there would have to be an overabundance of divas or freeloaders and I've never seen a show with either. I don't see how one or two divas can ruin the night for every other singer in the bar. The scenario you describe seems to be one where the crowd seems to enjoy all of the attention that the diva receives from the crowd. If they didn't enjoy it, why would they participate in it? I've seen "Elvis" impersonators at karaoke that the crowd really seems to enjoy. One of them in particular is a pretty bad singer but he seems to fit all of your requirements for being a diva, yet the crowd loves his performances. More of the people seem to be laughing "at him" than enjoying the singing but he is definitely entertaining. As soon as his name is announced as the next singer, the crowd goes wild. He even gives out scarves every now and again. Whether you agree or not, the KJs around here figure that a "character" like this guy adds something to the show and people bring their friends to check out the comical "Elvis guy". I'll take the talented Mariah Carey wannabe over the NO TALENT drunk any day. It's only a few minutes. Let the divas have their moment in the sun. They're just having their own kind of fun and shouldn't be looked down upon just because they can sing well while having their fun.

I get e-mails for karaoke shows and part of the e-mail that is trying to encourage people to come out to the show says "come out to the show with your friends and your fellow employees and show off for them". I think all of us, to some extent, would love to be rock stars for a song or three and karaoke gives us that opportunity. Why do certain KJs want to discourage that? Some karaoke companies have it written right on their business cards: COME OUT AND LET US MAKE YOU A STAR!!! What happens at your show NLouch when someone acts like a STAR????? You denigrate them for acting like a diva. WAKE UP!!! That is the fantasy of singing at karaoke for some people. The lousy singers get their 5 minutes to annoy just about everyone but the divas get insulted for annoying YOU and only you apparently. I've seen plenty of people head for the exits to have a smoke when the lousy singers get up to sing but I hardly ever see that happen when one of the divas get up to sing. The customers, singing and non-singing, seem to look forward to it very much. Like most people that host karaoke shows have pointed out, the percentage of really good singers at any given show is relatively low so why all the hubbub over such a seemly minor problem? I'll bet that you have no problems when a VERY SEXY tone deaf singer gets up on stage and struts her stuff and acts like a PORN STAR but GOD FORBID a talented singer expects a little extra attention.

In Michigan, it is ILLEGAL for any bar or club (without an "impossible to get special event license") to give out ANYTHING that is valued at $200 or more in a single night inside the club.

We never do "contests" period. We don't pit customers against either and tell one they "suck" while another is "great." We don't do them because it does nothing but filll a club for one night with a bunch of water drinkers that don't tip squat and pisses off all the "real regulars" that frequent the club and spend money.

Lovely little rant. However, you couldn't be more wrong.

The problem is not non-existant. I have pulled out of a venue because of not wanting the hassle of it. I have never returned to shows because of it.

The crowds I play to (large and many) cannot stand the attitude either.

I deride nobody, but the crowds do! They laugh, and "woooo handbag tantrum" when a diva has a little hissy.

Here - I shall repeat it: I like good singers. I like to see people enjoying themselves. I like bad singers too. I dislike the arrogant attitude that goes with a lot of "supposedly good" singers - these are the Divas!

The "Elvis" guy you described sounds great IMHO, not a diva at all. Because his attitude is great.



Me too. But these people are not talented. They are mockeries. Wailing, waving their arms, grasping the air, because someone once said "Oh wow, you should try out for American Idol" - they now believe themselves to be amazing.

But hey, you must know my area, my shows and my audience really well, obviously! Otherwise you'd not be qualified to make such inane rants directed towards me...

Oh, wait...

Am done here!

You have to be aware that CONTESTS are COMPETETIONS and therefore some of the FUN can be taken away. That being said ...a GOOD HOOK is - in addition to the SERIOUS singers ..maybe have a category for VIRGINS singers or FUN category of some type. just my $.02

Whatever you do --impartial judging is the KEY

Oh 100%! People love to shout "Scam" "Fix" or justify why they didn't win (unfairly).

Do your best to remove that opportunity.

* OFF TOPIC *

I run a quiz night where after the quiz we play higher or lower (6 cards, turned over in sequence, but contestant must say higher or lower before). I sell tickets for this before we play it. Then call out a contestant akin to a raffle.

People started shouting "Fix", and before I understood the nature of it - it riled me. Now I know they are just joking and playing along. I shout "Fix" with them. And they shout it at me in the street. I've even had one get my number and call me one day yelling "Fix" down the phone. It's fun banter!

There's a bar where a friend of mine KJ's that has a weekly karaoke contest with a $100 cash prize followed by a big one every 5 weeks where they give away $500. Initially, it seemed pretty cool and I would participate regularly. The $100 contests were based on who cheered the loudest (in other words whoever brought the most people). The premise of encouraging people to bring their friends and rewarding those who do so in theory seems sound. The problem though is that even the largest party rarely makes up the majority of the audience and as such in catering to what you think is the majority you isolate the real majority.
As a result of this strategy, participation began waining and as such the $100 cash prize was reduced to $50. They still have the $500 contests but participation in those is dropping off too. I stopped participating because I've moved, know I'll never win and I hate the scene there anyway (mostly conducive to high school dropouts).
With the diminished audience, my friend is now frantically looking for a way to improve things but knows that killing the contest will make things worse and as such, has basically put him in a rut.
My opinions on contests is this:
1. They can be a good occassional change-up but as a weekly event I wouldn't do it.
2. Rather than catering exclusively to the divas who will always be looking for a place to go and sing (some exclusively for money), I would focus more on those who are reluctant and hesitant to sing because once they do and have fun doing it, they'll probably be back and will bring their friends too (the you have to sing since I did mentality). Less than 3 years ago I absolutely hated karaoke and now admittedly am a karaoke whore because of just one time when I was goaded into singing.
3. If I had an occassional contest for the good singers, I'd inversely have an occassional one for the bad singers kind of like the Gong Show where the winner is the one with the lowest vote total without getting gonged. Other fun contests might be something like an 80's karaoke contest or something like that where it's based on more than just one's singing merits or who has the most friends in attendance.

Hope that helps!

From a previous post:




I'm gonna be the fly in the ointment and issue a caveat: I have seen at least four venues completely lose/close out karaoke due to contests. I tell owners up front that I will NEVER do one. Here's my reasoning, all from past experience:

1) 99% of new customers will return to their regular venue after the contest, unless you are EXCEPTIONAL, and if you are, you probably still won't have the opportunity to showcase during the contest.


2) Newbies walking into the bar will be too nervous to try singing around all that talent, and these ARE possible new REGULAR singers- bread & butter.


3) Regulars not entered in the contest will get upset about the lack of air time for them, forcing them to look for a different venue.


4) Judging: No one will be convinced it's fair. Applause? Singers will load the place with their friends if they can. Impartial judges? If they're anywhere near local they will know at least some of the singers, and the singers will know that, and never believe they are impartial.


5) You get to deal with all of the egos and whining for no extra pay. Then, the sore losers, who may have been regulars at your shows at OTHER venues, disappear both from the contest venues and your others. It has been my experience that most bars AND HOSTS lose much more than they gain with contests....AND the host ALWAYS gets most of the blame/bad feelings.


One example that I came across was a venue that had a very successful show for 9 YEARS. The owners had never run a contest and convinced the host (who knew better) to give it a shot.

Result? I felt the best person won (No, I didn't judge, sing, Host, or have any part of it) deserved to due to both talent and performance. Still, hurt feelings, nasty letters, dwindled attendance, and karaoke ended there within a month.


Have there been successful contests? Probably, but I've never seen one that hasn't done more damage than good in the long run.

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"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

Again i've run contests for over 17 years now, we usually have at least 1 major contest per year & run little weekly contests throughout. The major ones are usually 5-10 weeks long, yes they do bring out the better singers from around - yes they could be classified as diva's. The contestants themselves are required to spend a $5 minimum - we also have an entry fee of $5 that goes toward the prizes as well. Karaoke contests are absolutely no different than ANY other game that is supposed to be 'fun' & can be competitive. Battle of the bands would be the closest thing, so don't call it a karaoke constest, call it battle of the singers? Whatever, if it's fun, people DO & WILL want to compete at it.
Will it piss off your regulars that don't win, sometimes. Will you lose customers, sometimes! Will you gain new customers, sometimes! As far as it bringing in the water drinkers, this I have seen in the contestants until they sing, then they will tend to get a little loose and drink up, plus the people they bring with are typically drinking enough to make up for anyones shotfalls. If people do not want to get into the contest then they do not have to. You could do qualifying rounds before regular karaokek starts - you only have an hour to qualify or something like that. Then the finals figure out how many contestants, how many songs with an avg of 4 min per song (will each contestant do 1 song only or a 2 song of 1 fast, 1 slow) & then start that much earlier. This way it isn't biting too hard into the regular karaoke night, it is going to be good entertainment as finals usually have the better singers and the bar/club is typically packed!
Also NEVER use applause as a judging criteria. If someone happens to come that is outstanding but only brought 1 person with them, but someone else who is an ok singer brought a group of 20 with them, who is going to be louder for who? It then turns into a who brought more people in contest & not so much a singing contest.

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My advice...do a drawing instead. Every time someone sings, their name goes into the drawing. Then everyone has the same chance of winning as long as they sing.

Contests drive more people away than they bring in. They tend to leave a sour taste in people's mouths.

birdofsong

WOW!!!!!!! I can't say that I'm surprised by the wide range of opinions. First, let me once again say thanks to all that replied. Everybody had valid points and issues that need to be dealt with. Like I said, I have run successful contests in the past and with the exception of the "hired guns", I have never lost a regular. Sure, there are hurt feelings, but my folks regard me as honest and fair.....to a fault sometimes. I never have a problem telling someone they sang the wrong song or that they should practice at home before trying something in public. I'm blunt, but fair, and they know it. I have some of the best singers in town, and I would put them up against any venues regulars. They seem to be pumped about a little friendly competition. Lonman.....thanks for the tips about radio personalities. That may be the missing "hook" I was looking for. My contests are judged on 3 categories.....vocals.....stage presence....and yes, crowd response.

As far as radio personalities, you can try for the mainstream, sometimes you will get lucky & they have the time, but mostly the local college stations are going to be a good bet & like I said sometimes they will give free airplay for the contest!

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Just make sure you have your bases covered. If there is the slightest hint that something is fishy, you will get a bad rep whether it is true or not..

I saw it happen before I got into the biz. My co-workers and I would always go to Karaoke night at this bar, and they decided to have a "Local Idol" contest with a trip to the Bahama's as the grand prize. Now...we knew something was up when we arrived and saw that the usual karaoke host wasn't hosting...there was a new guy we had never seen before running the contest. Then whadda-ya know, the normal host gets called up as a contestant and you guessed it...proceeds to win the contest.

There were supposed independent judges, and the excuse was "well she isn't working tonight" but it didn't matter because the perception was that it was fixed and when dealing with the public, perception IS reality. They lost a LOT of people that night. One co-worker who was a karaoke regular & contest finalist has never been back to this day, even though that host is long gone. And my office used to spend a LOT of money at that bar.

And as a former Radio personality (17 years), offering the jock free food and drinks will go a long way in getting them to participate.

Wow... Just wow.

If I went to a contest at anywhere I even had previously hosted, I wouldn't enter purely because of how it would look. But a resident host to enter an then win? It's a little blatant.

Whether a setup or not, it's still wrong IMHO.

WOW!!!!!!! I'm with you. I quit entering contests when I started this gig. Like you said.....perception is everything and I would never want it perceived that I was a part of some fix. I wouldn't tolerate it at my place nor would I want to be a part of it at another. Thanks for all the tips, and I look forward to comparing notes with all the good folks on here. Thanks for making me feel welcome.

I just found out last night that a room very close to mine is going to start karaoke. And they're hoping to get it off the ground with a contest with some serious prize money.

This guy's got a good size PA too... Peavey, but with double 18" subs. They're definitely going after my group.

I'll let you all know how this all goes in the coming weeks. To be honest if he siphons a little business off it won't break my heart. Last Thursday I didn't even get two rounds in between 11 and 2:30 close. But I hope I still stay a little busy.